R1b-L389: Eastern Branch of R1b-L761?

[rmstevens2]

Thanks, they provide a brief and at the same time excellent overview of R1b, its clades, their relationships and where they have been found so far.

To me it shows that all of L389 is of decidedly eastern origin, that is, east of peninsular Europe.

I think that is actually true of PF6323, as well. It wasn't native to peninsular Europe either, but came from the east. It was just the first R1b clade into peninsular Europe.

[rmstevens2]

The authors of the recent Lazaridis et al (April 2024) preprint, "The Genetic Origin of the Indo-Europeans", see in R1b-V1636 (L389>BY15337>V1636) the key to the spread of Indo-Anatolian from the steppe to Anatolia (modern Turkey).

This is from page 20 of that preprint:

We thus propose the following hypothesis: that CLV [Caucasus Lower Volga] cline people migrated southwards ca. 4400BCE, or about a millennium before the appearance of the Yamnaya, (admixing with different substratum populations along the way) and then westwards before finally reaching Central Anatolia.

We in fact find Y-chromosome evidence that is consistent with the autosomal evidence. Sporadic instances of the steppe-associated Y-chromosome haplogroup R-V1636 in West Asia occurred at Arslantepe43 in Eastern Anatolia and Kalavan9 in Armenia in the Early Bronze Age (~3300-2500 BCE) among individuals without detectible steppe ancestry45 and these could be remnants of the dilution process. This haplogroup was found in the male individual from Remontnoye, both individuals from Progress-2 5 and two of three males from Berezhnovka, in addition to its occurrence in eleven individuals of the Volga Cline and thus was a prominent lineage of the pre-Yamnaya steppe. Isolated instances have also been found beyond the steppe in Corded Ware individuals from Esperstedt in Germany17 and Gjerrild in Denmark. 51

[targaryen]

The authors of the recent Lazaridis et al (April 2024) preprint, "The Genetic Origin of the Indo-Europeans", see in R1b-V1636 (L389>BY15337>V1636) the key to the spread of Indo-Anatolian from the steppe to Anatolia (modern Turkey).

This is from page 20 of that preprint:

We thus propose the following hypothesis: that CLV [Caucasus Lower Volga] cline people migrated southwards ca. 4400BCE, or about a millennium before the appearance of the Yamnaya, (admixing with different substratum populations along the way) and then westwards before finally reaching Central Anatolia.

We in fact find Y-chromosome evidence that is consistent with the autosomal evidence. Sporadic instances of the steppe-associated Y-chromosome haplogroup R-V1636 in West Asia occurred at Arslantepe43 in Eastern Anatolia and Kalavan9 in Armenia in the Early Bronze Age (~3300-2500 BCE) among individuals without detectible steppe ancestry45 and these could be remnants of the dilution process. This haplogroup was found in the male individual from Remontnoye, both individuals from Progress-2 5 and two of three males from Berezhnovka, in addition to its occurrence in eleven individuals of the Volga Cline and thus was a prominent lineage of the pre-Yamnaya steppe. Isolated instances have also been found beyond the steppe in Corded Ware individuals from Esperstedt in Germany17 and Gjerrild in Denmark. 51

Yeah, I've believed that to be the case for years too. M269/L23 was tied with Core PIE, while V1636 with Proto-Anatolian.