Distribution of Y-chromosome DNA from around the world

[corrigendum]

The profile from which you're posting the data is sponsoring some highly dubious and even extremely fringe and debunked viewpoints like the idea that R1b entered western Europe via the ... Sahara. https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...78/photo/1

Lumping all J2, J1, G, E, R1b, R1a, I2 into single haplotype categories with labels like "E = Semitic" and "J2 = Persian", "J1 = Arabic" is unscientific and doesn't provide any actual information.

[lukpl]

The profile from which you're posting the data is sponsoring some highly dubious and even extremely fringe and debunked viewpoints like the idea that R1b entered western Europe via the ... Sahara. https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...78/photo/1

Lumping all J2, J1, G, E, R1b, R1a, I2 into single haplotype categories with labels like "E = Semitic" and "J2 = Persian", "J1 = Arabic" is unscientific and doesn't provide any actual information.

It was posted for US only. How he sorted and lumped data is not my problem. Also if he believed in some debunked theories. My interest is in simple breakdown for countries from 23me source which I posted. It looked believable and if someone want to fake data, he didn't make those detailed maps for US, it is huge amount of work. Someone would post just tables.

But if admins think it is something wrong they could delete post.
EDIT: I deleted this map for "MENA" haplos lumped together.

[corrigendum]

The profile from which you're posting the data is sponsoring some highly dubious and even extremely fringe and debunked viewpoints like the idea that R1b entered western Europe via the ... Sahara. https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...78/photo/1

Lumping all J2, J1, G, E, R1b, R1a, I2 into single haplotype categories with labels like "E = Semitic" and "J2 = Persian", "J1 = Arabic" is unscientific and doesn't provide any actual information.

It was posted for US only. How he sorted and lumped data is not my problem. Also if he believed in some debunked theories. My interest is in simple breakdown for countries from 23me source which I posted. It looked believable and if someone want to fake data, he didn't make those detailed maps for US, it is huge amount of work. Someone would post just tables.

But if admins think it is something wrong they could delete post.
EDIT: I deleted this map for "MENA" haplos lumped together.

I don't mind your posts. I was just commenting on the issues which emerge when lineages are grouped under single haplotypes.

[lukpl]

The profile from which you're posting the data is sponsoring some highly dubious and even extremely fringe and debunked viewpoints like the idea that R1b entered western Europe via the ... Sahara. https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...78/photo/1

Lumping all J2, J1, G, E, R1b, R1a, I2 into single haplotype categories with labels like "E = Semitic" and "J2 = Persian", "J1 = Arabic" is unscientific and doesn't provide any actual information.

It was posted for US only. How he sorted and lumped data is not my problem. Also if he believed in some debunked theories. My interest is in simple breakdown for countries from 23me source which I posted. It looked believable and if someone want to fake data, he didn't make those detailed maps for US, it is huge amount of work. Someone would post just tables.

But if admins think it is something wrong they could delete post.
EDIT: I deleted this map for "MENA" haplos lumped together.

I don't mind your posts. I was just commenting on the issues which emerge when lineages are grouped under single haplotypes.

Yes, personally i also want to see every subclade distribution, maybe in the future someone made such tables/maps based on those data.

[Mythbuster General]

The German and French leak data seem to contain a very large dataset, meaning they might be the most solid regional breakdowns yet for the two countries.

[lukpl]

Now Scandinavia...
"The Y haplogroup distribution of Denmark, Iceland, Norway, and Sweden.
The data was taken from the 23andme leak. All 23,601 men had Scandinavian ancestry and a Scandinavian last name."
So probably mainly form US?


I made simple PCA

[Riverman]

The German and French leak data seem to contain a very large dataset, meaning they might be the most solid regional breakdowns yet for the two countries.

I hope for some regional breakdown and haplogroup statistics. Taht would be nice.

[Villanovan]

I wanted to create a thread where we can collectively post all the data that we have regarding Y-DNA distribution among various peoples of the world and make comparisons, have a discussion about them.

One of the most well-known ones is the one from Eupedia, but I see it was last updated in 2017 and I am aware it's not as representative with all populations they cover: https://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_...oups.shtml

For example I just collected 980 individual samples from Hungarians, which is the largest Y-DNA collection as of yet regarding them, and this is their distribution:
1. R-M420 (R1a): 28%
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.5%
3. I-M438 (I2): 17%
4. E-M215 (E1b1b): 9%
5. I-M253 (I1): 7.5%
6. J-M172 (J2): 7.5%
7. G-M201: 4.5%
8. N-M231: 3.5%
9. Q-M242: 1.5%
10. J-M267 (J1): 0.5%
11. T-L206: 0.5%
12. L-M20: 0.5%
13. C-F3393 (C1): 0.5%

From FTDNA database

Hungary % (n=1066)

1. R-M420 (R1a): 20.07 (214)
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.85 (201)
3. J-M172 (J2): 12.10 (129)
4. I-P215 (I2): 11.63 (124)
5. E-M96: 9.28 (99)
6. J-M267 (J1): 7.97 (85)
7. I-M253 (I1): 6.75 (72)
8. G-M201: 5.72 (61)
9. Q-M242: 2.62 (28)
10. N-M231: 2.06 (22)
11. T-M184: 1.22 (13)
12. L-M20: 0.19 (2)
13. C-M216: 0.19 (2)
14. Others: 1.32

[Riverman]

I wanted to create a thread where we can collectively post all the data that we have regarding Y-DNA distribution among various peoples of the world and make comparisons, have a discussion about them.

One of the most well-known ones is the one from Eupedia, but I see it was last updated in 2017 and I am aware it's not as representative with all populations they cover: https://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_...oups.shtml

For example I just collected 980 individual samples from Hungarians, which is the largest Y-DNA collection as of yet regarding them, and this is their distribution:
1. R-M420 (R1a): 28%
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.5%
3. I-M438 (I2): 17%
4. E-M215 (E1b1b): 9%
5. I-M253 (I1): 7.5%
6. J-M172 (J2): 7.5%
7. G-M201: 4.5%
8. N-M231: 3.5%
9. Q-M242: 1.5%
10. J-M267 (J1): 0.5%
11. T-L206: 0.5%
12. L-M20: 0.5%
13. C-F3393 (C1): 0.5%

From FTDNA database

Hungary % (n=1066)

1. R-M420 (R1a): 20.07 (214)
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.85 (201)
3. J-M172 (J2): 12.10 (129)
4. I-P215 (I2): 11.63 (124)
5. E-M96: 9.28 (99)
6. J-M267 (J1): 7.97 (85)
7. I-M253 (I1): 6.75 (72)
8. G-M201: 5.72 (61)
9. Q-M242: 2.62 (28)
10. N-M231: 2.06 (22)
11. T-M184: 1.22 (13)
12. L-M20: 0.19 (2)
13. C-M216: 0.19 (2)
14. Others: 1.32

Are these ethnic Hungarians or is this the general frequency for FTDNA testers from Hungary? Because many testers from Hungarfy are Jewish, and there are a couple of other minorities as well. This might explain among other things the relatively high frequency of J1.

[Mythbuster General]

I wanted to create a thread where we can collectively post all the data that we have regarding Y-DNA distribution among various peoples of the world and make comparisons, have a discussion about them.

One of the most well-known ones is the one from Eupedia, but I see it was last updated in 2017 and I am aware it's not as representative with all populations they cover: https://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_...oups.shtml

For example I just collected 980 individual samples from Hungarians, which is the largest Y-DNA collection as of yet regarding them, and this is their distribution:
1. R-M420 (R1a): 28%
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.5%
3. I-M438 (I2): 17%
4. E-M215 (E1b1b): 9%
5. I-M253 (I1): 7.5%
6. J-M172 (J2): 7.5%
7. G-M201: 4.5%
8. N-M231: 3.5%
9. Q-M242: 1.5%
10. J-M267 (J1): 0.5%
11. T-L206: 0.5%
12. L-M20: 0.5%
13. C-F3393 (C1): 0.5%

From FTDNA database

Hungary % (n=1066)

1. R-M420 (R1a): 20.07 (214)
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.85 (201)
3. J-M172 (J2): 12.10 (129)
4. I-P215 (I2): 11.63 (124)
5. E-M96: 9.28 (99)
6. J-M267 (J1): 7.97 (85)
7. I-M253 (I1): 6.75 (72)
8. G-M201: 5.72 (61)
9. Q-M242: 2.62 (28)
10. N-M231: 2.06 (22)
11. T-M184: 1.22 (13)
12. L-M20: 0.19 (2)
13. C-M216: 0.19 (2)
14. Others: 1.32

There are many Hungarians of ethnic Jewish origin on FTDNA, I tried to collect people with largely Hungarian ethnic origin for a more accurate picture, even though I'm sure there are partial-Slovaks/Germans/Jews in my results too.

[Villanovan]

I wanted to create a thread where we can collectively post all the data that we have regarding Y-DNA distribution among various peoples of the world and make comparisons, have a discussion about them.

One of the most well-known ones is the one from Eupedia, but I see it was last updated in 2017 and I am aware it's not as representative with all populations they cover: https://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_...oups.shtml

For example I just collected 980 individual samples from Hungarians, which is the largest Y-DNA collection as of yet regarding them, and this is their distribution:
1. R-M420 (R1a): 28%
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.5%
3. I-M438 (I2): 17%
4. E-M215 (E1b1b): 9%
5. I-M253 (I1): 7.5%
6. J-M172 (J2): 7.5%
7. G-M201: 4.5%
8. N-M231: 3.5%
9. Q-M242: 1.5%
10. J-M267 (J1): 0.5%
11. T-L206: 0.5%
12. L-M20: 0.5%
13. C-F3393 (C1): 0.5%

From FTDNA database

Hungary % (n=1066)

1. R-M420 (R1a): 20.07 (214)
2. R-M343 (R1b): 18.85 (201)
3. J-M172 (J2): 12.10 (129)
4. I-P215 (I2): 11.63 (124)
5. E-M96: 9.28 (99)
6. J-M267 (J1): 7.97 (85)
7. I-M253 (I1): 6.75 (72)
8. G-M201: 5.72 (61)
9. Q-M242: 2.62 (28)
10. N-M231: 2.06 (22)
11. T-M184: 1.22 (13)
12. L-M20: 0.19 (2)
13. C-M216: 0.19 (2)
14. Others: (14)

Are these ethnic Hungarians or is this the general frequency for FTDNA testers from Hungary? Because many testers from Hungarfy are Jewish, and there are a couple of other minorities as well. This might explain among other things the relatively high frequency of J1.

General frequency. Many of them must be Ashkenazi, precisely. So I tend to agree. But part of what may seem Ashkenazi could have been carried (not only) by Migration Period nomadic groups (see the samples from the 'Whole genome analysis sheds light on the genetic origin of Huns, Avars and conquering Hungarians').
In addition, while J and E are more frequent among Ashkenazi, R1b and R1a are not uncommon among them (abt. 20%, together). And this bias doesn't seem to explain the differences between R1a and R1b, in relation to the estimate I quoted and also Eupedia's, unless we assume R1b is way more frequent among Ashkenazi in Hungary than R1a, however, their frequencies are actually close to each other, overall. Perhaps R1b is a bit more frequent than R1a in Central-Eastern Europe, while R1a would be a bit more frequent than R1b in Eastern Europe?
Y-DNA E is the most common in Ashkenazi. The %s of E are similar in the two estimations though, so there would be significant differences between these estimations even subtracting Ashkenazi results.
When it comes to G-M201, G2b (or one of its subclades, way younger) is the "quintessential" Ashkenazi subgroup, although not exclusive, yet I estimate the Hungarians under G2b in FTDNA are just abt. 8% of those 5.72% of Gs. Adding an important margin, we could consider that less than 15% of G testers with Hungarian flag in FTDNA are Ashkenazi; extrapolating this number, we would still get important frequencies for haplogroups such as J1. Mind you, from Ethnopedia, J1 has a worthy of note frequency even in Friuli-Venezia Giulia, and I don't think it's explained by Ashkenazi.
Finally, I understand what you meant by ethnic Hungarians, and I said I tend to agree, however, I would say that Ashkenazi Hungarians are also Hungarians. I prefer arguing that Ashkenazi may be perhaps overrepresented in the FTDNA database, considering that many testers are from the US, which would result in a little bias in favor of the most frequent Ashkenazi clades. The most negatively affected by this little bias, in terms of frequency, would be clades less common among Ashkenazi, like I2, I1, N...

There are many Hungarians of ethnic Jewish origin on FTDNA, I tried to collect people with largely Hungarian ethnic origin for a more accurate picture, even though I'm sure there are partial-Slovaks/Germans/Jews in my results too.

No problem. I understand.

[Riverman]

Ashkenazi do more DNA testing in general and are overrepresented for all regions in which they lived, relatively speaking. This is particularly noteworthy for countries like Ukraine, Belorussia, Poland, Romania, Russia, Austria and Hungary. This just completley ruins the local ethnic populations percentages. Its not the Ashkenazi testers fault, its great they test so much, but we just can't use these numbers for the local population, since they are not representative. If a population had say 3 percent Ashkenazi Jews, the percentage among testers might by far exceed that number, let's say 20 % of the testers might Ashkenazi. That's a massive shift for all the frequencies in a region.

Concerning haplogroup, the main difference between ethnic Hungarians and Ashkenazi from Hungary is the exact subclade, because in Europeans E-V13 is most common, in Ashkenazi other subclades like downstream of E-M34. There are some Jewish branches under E-V13, but those don't matter that much percentage wise, while E-M34 really does.

You can instantly see that on the frequency map for E-M34:
https://discover.familytreedna.com/y-dna.../frequency

In Europe, the hotspots are not like otherwise expected in the South, but in the Central and Eastern European countries with significant amounts of Jewish testers. Belarus has more than Greece and Turkey, which simply wouldn't be the case if counting ethnic Belorussians/Slavs only.

As for R1b, its not just Jews, but Germans also, which likely increase R1b vs. R1b. However, the borderline between Hungarian and German is way more blurred since the Germanic/German contribution is at the roots of many modern ethnic Hungarians. Still if someone has a paternal lineage which was all German in the last generations, it should be counted separately.

[Pylsteen]

For reference, Ashkenazi haplogroup frequency, based on what I found in the FTDNA discover tool last month (with pre-research in Avotaynu's and Penninx' lineages), I will discuss this topic in a later moment.

   

[Riverman]

For reference, Ashkenazi haplogroup frequency, based on what I found in the FTDNA discover tool last month (with pre-research in Avotaynu's and Penninx' lineages), I will discuss this topic in a later moment.

R-L51 is higher than I thought it would.

[Pylsteen]

For reference, Ashkenazi haplogroup frequency, based on what I found in the FTDNA discover tool last month (with pre-research in Avotaynu's and Penninx' lineages), I will discuss this topic in a later moment.

R-L51 is higher than I thought it would.

Some lineages might have more testers, such as the Levite R1a-Z93 branch or the Cohanim J1-Z18271 subbranches.
And some are a bit underrepresented at jewishdna.net, for example, R1b-DF27>FGC20759 is a fairly large group at FTDNA (back then, n=58 of a total n=3269, and in that number I did exclude the downstream "Sephardic" branches, such as the DF27>Y31658 branch). Other fairly large ones here are the (Visigoth?) R1b-U106>FGC8564, R1b-U152>L4, the Epstein lineage R1b-U152>L2>BY13143 and  R1b-L21>Z18106 (likely picked up in England). 
For your interest may be the lineage E-V13>BY77657 .