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An attempt at deep West Eurasian phylogeny
(11-17-2023, 06:22 AM)PopGenist82 Wrote:
(11-13-2023, 04:09 PM)zocram Wrote:
(11-12-2023, 12:00 AM)Kale Wrote:
(11-11-2023, 10:37 PM)PopGenist82 Wrote: All Anatolian C1a2 falls within one of 2 clades found in Europe. Likely expanded to Anatolia from lower Danube

Add - adapted from ftDNA

[Image: w6XsoYN.png]

Let's wait and see Mesolithic data from Greece or southern Balkans.

Anatolian C nested within European C should help support the idea that C1a2 starts in Europe and migrates to Anatolia. C-BY1463 obfuscates the date of when that happened.
Maybe C-BY1463 is associated with Epipaleolithic migration from Anatolia to Europe, e.g. mt-K1, U8b, H13, T2, etc. observed in IronGates, Ukraine, Russia.

Since I believe that you are one of the most  objective and experts in Paleolithic genetics among the users of genetics forums I would like to ask you and anyone who is able to answer me how the current distribution of the most basal subclades of haplogroup I -m170, i2 (and also mtdna u5) can help us to shed light on the migrations of this fundamental whg haplogroup to trace whg origins; unfortunately I know that it will be almost impossible to have a lot high resolution samples of ancient upper paleolithic DNA from populations from turkey, caucasus, middle east etc... and I wondered if modern DNA could help us at least .
I looked on the familitreedna projects (i2c, im-170) and it seems that the most basal forms come from Turkey and the Caucasus, but I could be wrong .thanks
https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/i-2...background
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/y-dna-haplotree/I

No that is certainly not the case. There’s no “basal’ haplogroup I in western Asia, although the IJ split might have occurred in the Caucasus, theres not surviving IJ* or I*.
What you're seeing is many results there are left as I* because the testers (whether they lost interest or cant afford), haven’t obtained higher resolution tests.
But when there is adequate ‘zooming in’, modern as well as  ancient cases of I2 in the Middle East are nested within European diversity

Specifically for I2c, the Caucasus and Neolithic Turkish lineages are 2 distinctive sub-clades, but both ultimately derive from Europe, but very different chronology & history. 
The Caucasian ones arrived in Bronze Age proto-Armenians, alongside R1b-M269, the Turkish Neolithic set came from Balkans in the Epipaleolithic or earlier (e.g. Gravettian—Aurignacian).

[Image: vkfPWG1.png]

Thus, I2c, like C1a unequivocally trace migrations from Europe to Anatolia. The same with mtDNA U8/K. 
This is not to say that WHG don’t have some form of Near Eastern admixture - they do. But it's not direct migration but due to complex set of interactions & shared deep ancestry.

What about this individual MX304 ? He was listed as IJ . 
MX304 MX304 Auvernier A297 Femur 2020 FurtwanglerNatureCommunications2020 Context: layer date based on individual in same burial 4675
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RE: An attempt at deep West Eurasian phylogeny - by TanTin - 11-17-2023, 06:49 AM

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