Pre Pottery Neolithic A Site Map

[East Anglian]

Personally I think the most exciting development in the prehistory of western Eurasia over the past dozen years.  We should be discussing this step towards urbanisation and agriculture.

Do you guys associate this genetically with Anatolian Neolithic Farmers?

[pelop]

The Anatolia_Neolithic profile (Barcin-Mentese) is kind of a misnomer, in the sense that it already included Natufian and Iran_N/CHG admixtures compared to Epipaleolithic Anatolians. I'm going by this:

https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reic...thic_1.pdf

So I suppose the classic "fertile crescent" map mirrors the genetic clines that were starting to form between Natufians, Anatolians, Mesopotamians and Iranians.

[East Anglian]

Yes I'm genuinely interested in hearing opinions on this. Just who were the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers? What is the likelihood that they could have been descendants of the old SE Anatolian sites above? The evidence keeps insisting that they retained hunting-foraging well into the PPN A. How do the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers relate both the the Iranian Neolithic Farmers and to the European Neolithic farmers?

Can the builders of the Neolithic monuments on Orkney, claim descent (through admixture) from some of those that built Gobekli Tepe?

[ChrisR]

The Anatolia_Neolithic profile (Barcin-Mentese) is kind of a misnomer, in the sense that it already included Natufian and Iran_N/CHG admixtures compared to Epipaleolithic Anatolians. I'm going by this:

https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reic...thic_1.pdf

So I suppose the classic "fertile crescent" map mirrors the genetic clines that were starting to form between Natufians, Anatolians, Mesopotamians and Iranians.

Interesting. Following this as I would like to understand the Post-LGM to Antiquity genetic development of Anatolia (and Armenia) better.

[Rufus191]

Yes I'm genuinely interested in hearing opinions on this. Just who were the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers? What is the likelihood that they could have been descendants of the old SE Anatolian sites above? The evidence keeps insisting that they retained hunting-foraging well into the PPN A. How do the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers relate both the the Iranian Neolithic Farmers and to the European Neolithic farmers?

Can the builders of the Neolithic monuments on Orkney, claim descent (through admixture) from some of those that built Gobekli Tepe?

I would like to see a map of Neolithic Farmer haplogroups that includes the UK. I think I have seen one for continental Europe, but alas probably on the other forums. I am not 100% certain, but I believe the makeup of the Neolithic farmers of the British Isles was somewhat different to that of the continent in that there were much less Y-DNA haplogroup G and more I? To me that would indicate, perhaps that the I were descended from WHG and represented a once serf or labourer class to the G, who originally brought farming up from Anatolia, who then set out to settle lands that the G men had not done so to any great extent further north.

[Strider99]

Yes I'm genuinely interested in hearing opinions on this. Just who were the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers? What is the likelihood that they could have been descendants of the old SE Anatolian sites above? The evidence keeps insisting that they retained hunting-foraging well into the PPN A. How do the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers relate both the the Iranian Neolithic Farmers and to the European Neolithic farmers?

Can the builders of the Neolithic monuments on Orkney, claim descent (through admixture) from some of those that built Gobekli Tepe?

I would like to see a map of Neolithic Farmer haplogroups that includes the UK. I think I have seen one for continental Europe, but alas probably on the other forums. I am not 100% certain, but I believe the makeup of the Neolithic farmers of the British Isles was somewhat different to that of the continent in that there were much less Y-DNA haplogroup G and more I? To me that would indicate, perhaps that the I were descended from WHG and represented a once serf or labourer class to the G,  who originally brought farming up from Anatolia, who then set out to settle lands that the G men had not done so to any great extent further north.

Interestingly, we do not have any Neolithic British samples with Y-DNA G yet, as far as I know. So far, all ancient male Neolithic samples from Britain carry Y-DNA I2. The samples are from the following studies: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41559-019-0871-9
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2108001119
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1818037116
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-04241-4

This figure is quite old now (and plenty of new samples have been published since) but it neatly illustrates the shift that occurred with the arrival of the Bell Beaker culture: 
The situation appears to have been similar in Ireland, since all the Neolithic Irish men whose DNA has been sequenced thus far also carried I2, with the exception of two individuals with Y-DNA H2.

[pelop]

Yes I'm genuinely interested in hearing opinions on this. Just who were the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers? What is the likelihood that they could have been descendants of the old SE Anatolian sites above? The evidence keeps insisting that they retained hunting-foraging well into the PPN A. How do the Anatolian Neolithic Farmers relate both the the Iranian Neolithic Farmers and to the European Neolithic farmers?

The farmers who migrated into the Balkans and the Mediterranean were just a subset of the farmers of Anatolia. We don't have enough samples to paint a complete picture but I'm guessing inner Anatolia had greater diversity than what we see in the first Neolithic Europeans. We have some clues about this diversity from the Boncuklu and Tepecik Ciftlik samples, which differ from Barcin in their affinities to Levantine Natufian, Iran_N, etc.

Can the builders of the Neolithic monuments on Orkney, claim descent (through admixture) from some of those that built Gobekli Tepe?

I suppose they could but I'm a bit skeptical about these distant connections in time and space, it's possible that these megalithic traditions could have arisen independently at different places and times.

[Chad]

I'm currently writing a book on the Neolithic, analyzing roughly 200 individuals (PPNA to EEF). Publication should be later this year.