Origins of M-458

[leonardo]

According to the "Ancestral Path" option at FTDNA Discovery there are 12 immediate descendants of YP263 over150 years of time passed, which makes for a rapid expansion. There are 118 present day testers at FTDNA. The TMRCA is 150 BCE. I think of the Zarubinsty Culture, where is butted up against the Przeworsk.

[leonardo]

This site has slightly adjusted the location of M458 at 5000 YBP. here is also M458 at 3100 YBP and 2400 YBP.

[okshtunas]

New basal L1029 individual(managed kit) of German ethnicity from Poland, more specifically Bydgoszcz (back when it was part of Prussia) recently appeared on yfull https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-L1029/

[okshtunas]

A new modern individual has been added in yfull who is R-M458>PF7521*. I messaged him and waiting on response. Unfortunately the sample is Nebula, and more often than not those kits fall off with no communication. 

https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-PF7521/

[leonardo]

I just noticed that I have another Big Y match. The man is from Hungary and our shared branch is R-Y2921, around 350CE. Currently there are 8 matches with German ancestry, 3 from Czechia, 3 from Poland and this man from Hungary. His terminal clade is R-FTB88328.
https://discover.familytreedna.com/y-dna...8328/story

[okshtunas]

A new modern individual has been added in yfull who is R-M458>PF7521*. I messaged him and waiting on response. Unfortunately the sample is Nebula, and more often than not those kits fall off with no communication. 

https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-PF7521/

Turns out the sample is active enough. He's actually from South Holland, Netherlands. 

Considering R-PF7521* is parent to CTS11962 and L260, his placement and origin is interesting.

[leonardo]

A new modern individual has been added in yfull who is R-M458>PF7521*. I messaged him and waiting on response. Unfortunately the sample is Nebula, and more often than not those kits fall off with no communication. 

https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-PF7521/

Turns out the sample is active enough. He's actually from South Holland, Netherlands. 

Considering R-PF7521* is parent to CTS11962 and L260, his placement and origin is interesting.

Obotrites?

[okshtunas]

A new modern individual has been added in yfull who is R-M458>PF7521*. I messaged him and waiting on response. Unfortunately the sample is Nebula, and more often than not those kits fall off with no communication. 

https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-PF7521/

Turns out the sample is active enough. He's actually from South Holland, Netherlands. 

Considering R-PF7521* is parent to CTS11962 and L260, his placement and origin is interesting.

Obotrites?

Doubtful. If he was L1029 sure.

[alexfritz]

There are now 31 descendant lineages of YP445, so it appears that my male-line kin were the opposite of my mother's maternal grandfather, Edgar Robinson, who had ten children, but all daughters.  The line appears to be Czech-German, with the Americans most likely of German descent (like myself), giving a preliminary 27 for Germany to 11 Czech, as I am assigning the eight American samples to Germany, given that German-Americans greatly outnumber Czech-Americans.

looks like another 2 were added just recently
and likewise alreadyupdated / featured on the Tree 

now 21 samples is not too bad for some first insights and thus far it seems that most German YP445s  are indeed YP445* (for now) and ~1/3 downstream YP729; but there are also 68 YP445s from country ? so there is still some potential left; i myself for example am not on Discovery YP445 either (on FTDNA as L1029+) as i did my downstream test with YSEQ (M458-pack) but if i would add myself with a known genealogy going back to the 1500s sGermany (markt Haltenbergstetten) then the FTDNA database def has atleast 8 YP729s Germany, and unknown how many else, though officialy now 7

[okshtunas]

There are now 31 descendant lineages of YP445, so it appears that my male-line kin were the opposite of my mother's maternal grandfather, Edgar Robinson, who had ten children, but all daughters.  The line appears to be Czech-German, with the Americans most likely of German descent (like myself), giving a preliminary 27 for Germany to 11 Czech, as I am assigning the eight American samples to Germany, given that German-Americans greatly outnumber Czech-Americans.

looks like another 2 were added just recently
and likewise alreadyupdated / featured on the Tree 

now 21 samples is not too bad for some first insights and thus far it seems that most German YP445s  are indeed YP445* (for now) and ~1/3 downstream YP729; but there are also 68 YP445s from country ? so there is still some potential left; i myself for example am not on Discovery YP445 either (on FTDNA as L1029+) as i did my downstream test with YSEQ (M458-pack) but if i would add myself with a known genealogy going back to the 1500s sGermany (markt Haltenbergstetten) then the FTDNA database def has atleast 8 YP729s Germany, and unknown how many else, though officialy now 7

I know it sounds dictatorial, but these companies really need to make adding recent ancestry info/flags mandatory, for the accuracy of data. Of course unless it's truly unknown. But, I wouldnt be surprised if a large number of the unknowns are known, and people are just lazy with filling it out.