04-13-2024, 04:37 PM
There's a sample labelled Ottoman_arab_graves. It's an average of 12 samples dating from the 1300s to the 1650s. These aren't Arabs, so moving along I'll refer to this sample as "Menteshe"
The average is very misleading. There's many in that average that are actually Turcomans (Half Turkic, Half Greek), yet they're being lumped into the same cluster as samples that have 15% Turkic, which is even less than modern Western Turkish standards.
So I think the samples from the 1300s, who most of which are half Turkic, should be separated from the later ones, who are sometimes even lower than modern Turkish averages.
This is Ottoman Turk Menteshe if you remove the lesser Turkic admixed ones, who are from later periods. It's a Turcoman.
[attachment=873]
[attachment=872]
[attachment=874]
So, as you can see, lumping them all together was a big mistake.
We actually also have another Turcoman. This one was sadly mislabelled as "Turkey_Ottoman_Turkish_Caucasian_possible"
This one most likely dates back to Seljuks, that's just my theory though.
This sample, unlike the Menteshe samples, seems to be half Cappadocian Greek half Oghuz Turkic.
Here are the results:
[attachment=870]
[attachment=871]
Now we have multiple Turcoman samples. How cool is that. And we can determine that a "pure" Oghuz would have been roughly 50% East Asian.
We actually already have an Oghuz sample, which was mislabelled Ottoman_TajikTurkic_possible, but I'll make a separate forum entry on that.
Here are the samples:
Seljuk_Turkoman,0.084229,-0.006093,0,-0.01615,-0.041854,-0.011435,-0.004935,-0.001615,-0.008181,-0.011299,-0.011367,-0.003297,-0.008622,-0.001651,0.004343,-0.00053,0.009257,-0.00266,0.002765,-0.01038,-0.006489,-0.000371,-0.007888,0.001205,0.002275
Ottoman_Turkoman,0.088213,-0.000254,0.0001885,-0.02543625,-0.02700525,-0.010737,0.0062275,0.00461525,-0.01319175,-0.00059225,-0.00856575,0.0045335,-0.00527775,-0.0045415,-0.00010175,-0.00092825,0.00342275,0.000665,0.0047135,0.00397075,-0.00795475,-0.0019785,0.00123225,0.000934,-0.0011975
The average is very misleading. There's many in that average that are actually Turcomans (Half Turkic, Half Greek), yet they're being lumped into the same cluster as samples that have 15% Turkic, which is even less than modern Western Turkish standards.
So I think the samples from the 1300s, who most of which are half Turkic, should be separated from the later ones, who are sometimes even lower than modern Turkish averages.
This is Ottoman Turk Menteshe if you remove the lesser Turkic admixed ones, who are from later periods. It's a Turcoman.
[attachment=873]
[attachment=872]
[attachment=874]
So, as you can see, lumping them all together was a big mistake.
We actually also have another Turcoman. This one was sadly mislabelled as "Turkey_Ottoman_Turkish_Caucasian_possible"
This one most likely dates back to Seljuks, that's just my theory though.
This sample, unlike the Menteshe samples, seems to be half Cappadocian Greek half Oghuz Turkic.
Here are the results:
[attachment=870]
[attachment=871]
Now we have multiple Turcoman samples. How cool is that. And we can determine that a "pure" Oghuz would have been roughly 50% East Asian.
We actually already have an Oghuz sample, which was mislabelled Ottoman_TajikTurkic_possible, but I'll make a separate forum entry on that.
Here are the samples:
Seljuk_Turkoman,0.084229,-0.006093,0,-0.01615,-0.041854,-0.011435,-0.004935,-0.001615,-0.008181,-0.011299,-0.011367,-0.003297,-0.008622,-0.001651,0.004343,-0.00053,0.009257,-0.00266,0.002765,-0.01038,-0.006489,-0.000371,-0.007888,0.001205,0.002275
Ottoman_Turkoman,0.088213,-0.000254,0.0001885,-0.02543625,-0.02700525,-0.010737,0.0062275,0.00461525,-0.01319175,-0.00059225,-0.00856575,0.0045335,-0.00527775,-0.0045415,-0.00010175,-0.00092825,0.00342275,0.000665,0.0047135,0.00397075,-0.00795475,-0.0019785,0.00123225,0.000934,-0.0011975